ECW: San Antonio Sub-Region

[Shocky]

Come in here to discuss the San Antonio Sub Region of the ECW Region, headlined by the Heartbreak kid Shawn Michaels. Remember, Extreme Rules apply.

The First Three Rounds Take Place In: San Antonio, TX
2. "The Heartbreak Kid" Shawn Michaels
63. "The Chairman of WCW" La Parka

31. "High Flyin" Jerry Lynn
34. Rick Steiner

15. "The Animal" Batista
50. Brian "Crush" Adams

18. Jushin Thunder Liger
47. "El Gigante" Giant Gonzalez

7. "The Next Big Thing" Brock Lesnar
58. "Primetime" Elix Skipper

26. Magnum T.A.
39. Scott Norton

10. "The Charismatic Enigma" Jeff Hardy
55. Ron "The Truth" Killings

23. "Mr. Wonderful" Paul Orndorff
42. Hakushi



Round 2 matches.
San Antonio, TX.

2. Shawn Michaels
31. Jerry Lynn

15. Batista
18. Jushin Thunder Liger


7. Brock Lesnar
26. Magnum T.A.

10. Jeff Hardy
42. Hakushi

Round 3 Matches:

San Antonio, TX
2. Shawn Michaels
18. Jushin Thunder Liger

7. Brock Lesnar
10. Jeff Hardy

 

[klunderbunker]

Mr. Hardy, it's been nice knowing you. You are about to die.

Jeff has absolutely no chance here. Lesnar killed him more than once, and if you throw him in a match where everything is legal, Jeff will be begging for a third wellness violation. Shawn vs. Brock is nothing short of a dream match. I don't care how big Brock is, he can get kicked in the jaw and pinned. He was a tank, but can he beat Shawn? I don't know. I could easily go for either of those two. It all comes down to who is left. A wildcard could throw this off, but I can't see anything other than a Minnesota vs. Texas showdown at the end.

 

[Mr. TM]

Brock is a fucking Boar here. in ECW, where he can bring kendo sticks into the fold here, I mean three per hand here, he is going to cover the crowd with blood. He has smashed Hardy in the ring, and will do the same to Shawn. Brock has the ability to kick out of the superkick, so Shawn will be needing to work on Brock before being torn apart.

 

[Danmen001]

Really? Really?

I don't care how much of a supposed tank Brock is. He is a tank, without a brain. Shots to the groin (possibly with weapons), and rake to the eye with barbed wire, he can be taken down. And Jeff can do that. Jeff my not be all Brock is body wise, but he's FAR smarter than Brock, and with his almost unmatched gimmick experience, he'd be knowing enough to hit him in the groin, and rake him in the eye. He can do that.

The fact that people are even considering Brock over Hardy in extreme rules, when Jeff in his prime is far superior to Brock in extreme matches, is quite sheepish. Vote Jeff Hardy.

 

[Shocky]

Quite Sheepish??? How in the hell is that possible. Brock Lesnar has a pay per view over not one, but two Hardy Boys, and in the same match, and that was Brocks first pay per view. I fail to see how Jeff Hardy, the wreckless throw my body around guy, has any chance in hell against someone like Brock. You know what happens when someone throws their body at Brock, Brock catches that person, lifts them on his shoulders, and F-5s them to hell. So long Mr. Hardy.

 

[Khalifa]

This is probably the dream match of the century here. I fail to see how Jeff Hardy would die as well. Lets see you have HBK, Hardy and Lesnar. Do you honestly think that Hardy and HBK could think they could take Lesnar one on one, no. So they would eaisly team up here and take Lesnar out ( a run in or something). I fail to see how Lesnar could win with Hardy in an extreme rules matches and HBK just doing what he always does. I honestly see HBK coming out and winning this match.

 

[Steamboat Ricky]

Why is everyone so close to jumping on the "Hardy v. Lesnar" train, anyway? I'm not even convinced that Hardy will advance that far. Hardy, up until about a year ago, was tag-team mid-card talent...yet by his 10 ranking in the ECW bracket, it suggests that he is one of the top 40 of all time. I just don't really see how that adds up. Unless Hardy is jumping off of a ladder, I don't see how he has the versatility in an extreme rules setting to go over a lot of people. If he faces a guy like Tommy Dreamer in the first two rounds, he's out.

 

[Checkmate]

Well, we don't know who Hardy is facing, so I'm going to jump to the conclusion that both Hardy and Brock advance to face each other. If that happens, I cannot vote against Brock. He is too much of a beast. Hardy is un-concentrated hardcore aggression. He'll throw himself at Brock and give him one hell of a fight, but in the end, I don't see it happening.

This reminds me of the ladder match between Hardy and Undertaker. Taker was out of his element, and Hardy was definately in his. Yet, Hardy lost. Substitute in Brock with Taker. Brock could easily do more damage, as he doesn't need to climb a ladder to win. He can deal too much damage in this environment, and Hardy can't take enough damage to win.

Now, could Brock beat HBK? I don't know. HBK could be compared to Hardy, but HBK is more CONCENTRATED aggression. He can play the hardcore game, and has a moveset that can deal enough damage to keep Brock down for 3. I don't think this would be an easy match though. Finals here should be interesting.

 

[Tastycles]

This has to be the most interesting section of them all so far. Jeff Hardy vs Brock Lesnar will be a tight one. Jeff is definitely more experienced in this extreme setting, and has a history of going over people that are bigger than him. Lesnar has a lot of fans though, and his momentum going into their match up will be strong.

The winner of this match stands a chance against Shawn Michaels in the 4th round. I for one sincerely wish that it is Hardy v Michaels in a ladder match in that match. That will be incredibly hard to call.

However, the whole nature of the ECW division means that every match is a potential banana skin. Nobody in the world thinks that Shawn Michaels is a worse wrestler than The Sandman, but in extreme rules, it certainly isn't that simple.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

I'm thinking that Shawn Michaels may get upset in the final four or eight in this region. I see this going to Brock Lesnar. He has the power to hang with anybody regardless of size and he was dangerous without weapons. Just think about what he could do in a ECW ring. Hardy would be a tough out for him because of his extreme nature but Brock would reverse a Twist of Fate into a F-5 for the win.

 

[Danmen001]

The winner of this match stands a chance against Shawn Michaels in the 4th round. I for one sincerely wish that it is Hardy v Michaels in a ladder match in that match. That will be incredibly hard to call.

Not at all. It shouldn't be, anyway.

Hardy has beaten Michaels 1-2-3 clean, in a regular match. In Jeff's home, extreme rules, he would quite regularly beat HBK. And the HBK ladder match bandwagon doesn't even make sense in itself, because he hasn't even done that well in the ladder matches he has competed in.

Come on people, you know you want drugs.

 

[NSL]

I said it about Bruno, and I'll say it about HBK. He was already the weakest of the top 4, and now he's looking to be the weakest in his bracket. He'll need to pull of a few upsets before he even has a shot at getting to the gimmick matches, where his luck wil ldetermine how far he advances. He'd beat Hardy, or Lesnar, in any type of match, except an ECW match.

I'll admit I haven't seen much from Lesnar. But, nothing I've seen has impressed me. He'll probably go over HBK, if either of them make it as far, but I don't know how he'd do in a hardcore environment. He's big and strong, but not nearly as agile as Hardy or HBK, and has never taken a beating like he'd receive in ECW. He can either go far, or get taken out early. There is no middle road for Lesnar here.

Hardy is my odds-on favorite. I get what everyone is saying. But, no one has said this: Who can give him a beating that he can't take, just to climb the ropes and deliver a Swanton for the win? His body can take more punishment than anyone in the ECW Region, and he'll use the Extreme Rules to his advantage much more than Lesnar or Shawn. RVD excelled in ECW, and isn't half of what Hardy is in the ring. Hardy is well set to go through this bracket, and would do fine in almost any gimmick match, except for the Barbwire Rope Match. Take away the ropes, and half of his offense goes out the window.

 

[Papa Shango]

Brock Lensar will tear through this... until he meets HBK. As long as HBK doesn't face any major competition along the way, he should be able to get through Lesnar. Lesnar tends to underestimate people; he gets cocky, and he makes mistakes. This is not something you want happening in a Hardcore environment. HBK may be a man of God, but he's been known to become almost Satanic in the ring when he needs to be. All Lesnar has to do is make one rookie mistake and WHAM! Sweet Chin Music. And if he happens to make that mistake while he's holding a chair, and it's gonna be some Speed Metal.

 

[Deadman]

Hardy vs. HBK in a ladder match HBK would win just because the show stopper would find a way to turn tha match around and make Jeff realize who the champ is.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

There are so many things wrong with Danmen's post, that I have to break it into sections.

I don't care how much of a supposed tank Brock is. He is a tank, without a brain.

John Cena fan, eh?

Shots to the groin (possibly with weapons), and rake to the eye with barbed wire, he can be taken down.

If anyone of his opponents has the opportunity. In a possible Brock vs Jeff match up, Hardy isn't going to have the chance to grab a weapon and use it against Brock. In about fifteen seconds, Brock will have beaten Jeff or Shawn so badly that either would have the strength to knee him in the groin. Plus, they'd be halfway beaten into the mat, so it's not like they'd be in a position to low blow him.

And Jeff can do that. Jeff my not be all Brock is body wise, but he's FAR smarter than Brock,

Well, he is smart enough to burn his house down and get suspended for drugs twice. Intelligent man.

and with his almost unmatched gimmick experience, he'd be knowing enough to hit him in the groin, and rake him in the eye. He can do that.

Too bad Jeff Hardy is a babyface and never uses cheap shots. Besides, I've already explained that Jeff would be resembling a plate of lasagna within a minute, anyway.

The fact that people are even considering Brock over Hardy in extreme rules, when Jeff in his prime is far superior to Brock in extreme matches, is quite sheepish. Vote Jeff Hardy.

Did Brock Lesnar even have a moment in his career when he wasn't in his prime? No. The "in his prime" argument is invalid. This tournament takes place where every wrestler is at his best, elseways Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Bret Hart, and Randy Savage would have no shot. Andre the Giant, Chris Benoit, and Owen Hart would have even less of a chance. John Cena would be a lock. Therefore, it would be stupid for us to think of someone as they are now, rather than when in their prime.

It would be sheepish to vote for Brock over Jeff? Uh, what? That word makes very little sense there.

 

[Danmen001]

There are so many things wrong with Danmen's post, that I have to break it into sections.

The forum won't allow me to tell you what's wrong with your reply either, becuase it's far too big a response. I'll do my best to break it down for you.

John Cena fan, eh?

Could be worse, I could be a Santino fan.

If anyone of his opponents has the opportunity. In a possible Brock vs Jeff match up, Hardy isn't going to have the chance to grab a weapon and use it against Brock. In about fifteen seconds, Brock will have beaten Jeff or Shawn so badly that either would have the strength to knee him in the groin. Plus, they'd be halfway beaten into the mat, so it's not like they'd be in a position to low blow him.

What? There isn't any low blow psychology. So I don't know why you turned that into a paragraph.

Brock goes up to Jeff looking for a power move, jeff feints and whacks him in the crotch. If Brock is the machine poeple say he is, that'll hurt him more than most .

Well, he is smart enough to burn his house down and get suspended for drugs twice. Intelligent man.

The Chris Benoit Rule: Yes, it's the ugly little thing that wrestling fans are on one side of the fence or the other, Chris Benoit. This tournament is about wrestling, and the person in questions professional life, not their private life. Bringing up the Benoit Murders, the Hogan Family Circus, Steve Austin beating his wife, or anything really not relating to wrestling will get you an infraction, and eventually a banning from participation in the tournament. Try to keep the real life affairs out. If you find you can't vote for someone based on their real life issues, simply don't vote and stay away from matches those people are involved in.

Zoom, right over your head.

Too bad Jeff Hardy is a babyface and never uses cheap shots. Besides, I've already explained that Jeff would be resembling a plate of lasagna within a minute, anyway.

Umm, really? You obviously haven't watched many Jeff Hardy matches. He has, when legally able, used those moves. He even did it to the Undertaker (or Triple H?). So, yeah. What you said there is out the window.

Did Brock Lesnar even have a moment in his career when he wasn't in his prime? No. The "in his prime" argument is invalid.

I'm starting to think you haven't even read what I said.

When Jeff, is in his prime. Jeff, you know, the guy who is going to beat Brock in an extreme rules match.

This tournament takes place where every wrestler is at his best, elseways Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Bret Hart, and Randy Savage would have no shot. Andre the Giant, Chris Benoit, and Owen Hart would have even less of a chance. John Cena would be a lock. Therefore, it would be stupid for us to think of someone as they are now, rather than when in their prime.

Read my above response.

It would be sheepish to vote for Brock over Jeff? Uh, what? That word makes very little sense there.

Actually, if you had read what I said properly (which I noted before, I doubt you have), you'd probably have realised I meant it in the context of following what everyone else is saying.

Besides, you honestly saying you don't want drugs? Vote Jeff Hardy.

 

[Hip2bsquare]

Brock is the favourite in this Region imo. I see him facing HBK in the Region finals and that should be a kick ass contest for sure.

Although having said that is it could change as more people are added to the bracket.

As for a possible Lesnar vs Jeff Hardy bout. Jeff Hardy is a dead man walking in this case. Jeff can bring all his high flying and risk taking to the ring, he can bring Matt Hardy, Frank Hardy, Joe Hardy, hell even bring Laurel and Hardy with him. Brock destroys them all.

 

[NSL]

As for a possible Lesnar vs Jeff Hardy bout. Jeff Hardy is a dead man walking in this case. Jeff can bring all his high flying and risk taking to the ring, he can bring Matt Hardy, Frank Hardy, Joe Hardy, hell even bring Laurel and Hardy with him. Brock destroys them all.

I really can't figure out how everyone is discrediting the beating that Hardy can take, and still win. This is the man that's jumped off of just about everything, and still appeared on the next night's show. Lesnar can F-5 him all he wants, he'll still kick out, and will still hit a Swanton for the victory.

We're looking at the wrestler's prime, right? Can anyone say that Hardy's time from TNA until now, isn't his prime? Tell me how he doesn't take a beating the big guys can dish, and still find a way to win? The only big man I see as a threat is Vader, and that's because Vader can fly as well.

 

[Danmen001]

Brock is the favourite in this Region imo. I see him facing HBK in the Region finals and that should be a kick ass contest for sure.

Although having said that is it could change as more people are added to the bracket.

As for a possible Lesnar vs Jeff Hardy bout. Jeff Hardy is a dead man walking in this case. Jeff can bring all his high flying and risk taking to the ring, he can bring Matt Hardy, Frank Hardy, Joe Hardy, hell even bring Laurel and Hardy with him. Brock destroys them all.

I was going to respond to this myself, but then I liad my eyes upon:

I really can't figure out how everyone is discrediting the beating that Hardy can take, and still win. This is the man that's jumped off of just about everything, and still appeared on the next night's show. Lesnar can F-5 him all he wants, he'll still kick out, and will still hit a Swanton for the victory.

We're looking at the wrestler's prime, right? Can anyone say that Hardy's time from TNA until now, isn't his prime? Tell me how he doesn't take a beating the big guys can dish, and still find a way to win? The only big man I see as a threat is Vader, and that's because Vader can fly as well.

If I ever needed a reason to think you a good poster (which I didn't), this is it. Thank you! Someone gets it, and if you're not willing to listen to me, listen to this man.

Jeff Hardy can take all the punishment in the world, and still get back up. Maybe, maybe (but I still don't think so), of these matches were regular matches, Brock could surpass Hardy. Maybe. But this is Extreme Rules. E-C F'n-W. Jeff will take everything Lesnar throws at him, get back up. Low blow him, eye rake him with barbed wire then hit the Swanton Bomb for the win. You know, it doesn't even have to be a Swanton. Low blow, and roll up. It'd work. If I had been hit in the nuts, I don't think I'd be able to kick out. Lesnar may be a machine, but a strike to the groin is going to keep any real man down.

 

[HBK-aholic]

San Antonio FTW! Shawn has won the whole damn tournament from the ECW region before, and he can certainly do it again. Say goodbye to his opponent because they have no chance.

Shawn vs. Brock should be the final here, and My God what a final that would be. People could vote either way, I'm sure. But they should vote Shawn, because he's better. Don't let Shawn's size fool you in comparison to Brock, he can handle it with guys bigger than him, which has been proved many times.

 

[NSL]

You're right HBK did win from the ECW region before. But, he's facing an entirely new batch of opponents, with an entirely new batch of voters.

Plus, he has to contend with Vader, Big Show, and Andre. He can handle "big" guys, but not freakin' superhumans. Without Vince handling his booking, he's going to wish he stayed retired.

 

[HBK-aholic]

You're right HBK did win from the ECW region before. But, he's facing an entirely new batch of opponents, with an entirely new batch of voters.

If he's done it once, he can do it again. Shawn is just that damn good. And people need to realise that, when they say he doesn't have a chance in the ECW region, he did 2 years ago, and not that much has changed.

Plus, he has to contend with Vader, Big Show, and Andre. He can handle "big" guys, but not freakin' superhumans. Without Vince handling his booking, he's going to wish he stayed retired.

Wait, are you telling me Shawn can't handle Vader?? Go re-read my campaign thread for HBK, I posted a HBK vs. Vader match. HBK completely used his power and size against him. Muich the same for a match I only recently saw, against Yokozuna. Shawn can easily handle the 'superhumans' as you call them. He neutralises their power and size.

As for the Big Show as far as I'm aware there isn't a singles match for me to post between them. However he has had a Triple Threat with Kane and the Big Show, whicvh I believe he came out as the winner. Once again, neutralising power and size in the process. At one point, he had both Kane and The Big Show laid out on the mat, and won the match by delivering Sweet Chin Music to both of them. DO NOT write Shawn off here.

 

[NSL]

If he's done it once, he can do it again. Shawn is just that damn good. And people need to realise that, when they say he doesn't have a chance in the ECW region, he did 2 years ago, and not that much has changed.

Wait, are you telling me Shawn can't handle Vader?? Go re-read my campaign thread for HBK, I posted a HBK vs. Vader match. HBK completely used his power and size against him. Muich the same for a match I only recently saw, against Yokozuna. Shawn can easily handle the 'superhumans' as you call them. He neutralises their power and size.

As for the Big Show as far as I'm aware there isn't a singles match for me to post between them. However he has had a Triple Threat with Kane and the Big Show, whicvh I believe he came out as the winner. Once again, neutralising power and size in the process. At one point, he had both Kane and The Big Show laid out on the mat, and won the match by delivering Sweet Chin Music to both of them. DO NOT write Shawn off here.

You're right HBK did win from the ECW region before. But, he's facing an entirely new batch of opponents, with an entirely new batch of voters.

Plus, he has to contend with Vader, Big Show, and Andre. He can handle "big" guys, but not freakin' superhumans. Without Vince handling his booking, he's going to wish he stayed retired.

I've already stated my argument against Shawn.

He was #5 on my list, and I'm not trying to discredit him, but he's out of his league here. ECW is a completely different environment than he has ever seen. Sure, he'll win the first match or two, but I don't see him getting much further.

And, he only wins those first few matches, if they're not ECW Originals. Basically, he better hope he doesn't face Sabu or Rhyno. He'd be hurt. Badly. Even if he does, and fan support pushes him past them, he still has to face the big men. And then, what are his realistic chances in the gimmick matches? He may get lucky and find a favorable one in Round 4, but do you honestly feel, in your HBK-obsessed heart, that he stands a chance in hell of winning a Barbwire Match?

 

[HBK-aholic]

I've already stated my argument against Shawn.

But you didn't argue against anything I said .

He was #5 on my list, and I'm not trying to discredit him, but he's out of his league here. ECW is a completely different environment than he has ever seen. Sure, he'll win the first match or two, but I don't see him getting much further.

ECW is the environment in which he came to win the First ever WZ Tournament, so don't say he can't do it. He's done it before and he can do it again. Shawn is no stranger to matches with 'hardcore' rules. Was he not involved in the first HiaC match?

And, he only wins those first few matches, if they're not ECW Originals. Basically, he better hope he doesn't face Sabu or Rhyno. He'd be hurt. Badly. Even if he does, and fan support pushes him past them, he still has to face the big men. And then, what are his realistic chances in the gimmick matches? He may get lucky and find a favorable one in Round 4, but do you honestly feel, in your HBK-obsessed heart, that he stands a chance in hell of winning a Barbwire Match?

My HBK-obsessed heart feels Shawn has a good chance of winning any match because of how versatile he is. He made the first HiaC match the best ever. He win the WWE championship from the Elimination Chamber. He had the first televised ladder match. Shawn is no stranger to new concepts, and he'd treat this one just the same.

 

[NSL]

But you didn't argue against anything I said .

Because I thought I covered it all with "Without Vince handling his booking,"

ECW is the environment in which he came to win the First ever WZ Tournament, so don't say he can't do it. He's done it before and he can do it again.

He did it then, with different voters. You also need to remember how fresh in all of our minds this "JBL's bitch" storyline is. I remember him from the early days of his career, but that doesn't mean that everyone will. In the right match-up, HBK definitely stands a chance. That has more to do with the ECW environment than HBK's ability though. I don't see how he combats a guy like Vader, with ECW rules, and Paul E. Heyman handling the winners and losers.

Shawn is no stranger to matches with 'hardcore' rules. Was he not involved in the first HiaC match?

My HBK-obsessed heart feels Shawn has a good chance of winning any match because of how versatile he is. He made the first HiaC match the best ever. He win the WWE championship from the Elimination Chamber. He had the first televised ladder match. Shawn is no stranger to new concepts, and he'd treat this one just the same.

Shawn has had a chance to win whatever match he's in, because he's been babied by Vince and the WWE. He's had "hardcore" matches, but has he ever been in a match with barbwire involved? How about glass light tubes? Exploding tables? Suicide leaps off of 30 foot balconies?

Someone also said about Triple H, that he'd suffer in TNA, because of the small crowds, and not being in the spotlight. Don't you think HBK would suffer the same fate? Sure, he can headline Wrestlemania and put on a show in front of a crowd of 70,000. But, how would he handle a dimly lit, poorly ventilated ECW Arena, that holds maybe 1000 people?