Cena Region, Third Round, Hardcore Match: (3) Shawn Michaels vs. (6) Harley Race

[klunderbunker]

This is a third round match in the Cena Region and it is a Hardcore match. It will be held at Madison Square Garden in New York City, New York.

Rules: Anything goes and the fall can be earned anywhere.

#3. Shawn Michaels


Vs.

#6. Harley Race


​

Polls will be open for four days following a one day period for discussion. Voting will be based on who you feel is the greater of the two competitors. Post your reasons for why your pick should win below. Remember that this is non-spam and the most votes in the poll win. Any ties will be broken by the amount of posts of support for each candidate, with one vote per poster.


Also remember that this is a non-spam forum. If you post a response without giving a reason for your selection, it will be penalized for spam and deleted.

 

[Tastycles]

In the vast majority of gimmick matches that I have seen Michaels compete in, he takes an absolute beating like a trooper and then either loses or wins via some sort of BS interference. I think its best to discount interference here because it gets absolutely ridiculous, so we are left with the former possibility. Race was a huge name in the 70s and renown for his toughness. As such, I see a Race win here.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

I'm going with Harley Race here. Yeah Michaels is the king of the in ring performance but he's going against the 8 time NWA champion who is one of the toughest, baddest men in the history of the business and he's facing him in a match where Rave can be as sadistic as he wants to be. Granted, HBK will give him one hell of a match and he is no stranger to being the underdog who overcomes adversity (and he could very well do it here). With that said however I still think Race would win.

I see Race beating on Michaels for a long time, Michaels makes the comeback but makes a costly mistake at the end that Race takes advantage of and takes this match. Besides, Michaels won last year and Race deserves a deep run.

 

[NSL]

It pains me to say this, but I think I'm going for Race here. HBK would sell like he always does, and would put on one hell of an awesome match, but under hardcore rules...I think Tasty is right. HBK would bleed like a stuck pig in the majority of his gimmick matches, and then come up short. In his big gimmick match at MSG, he came up short to Razor, who is not nearly as tough as Race.

I'm not saying this is an easy decision, but I'm almost positive it's the right one.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

I'm still voting Shawn. Yes, he would bleed and bleed and bleed some more. yes he would take an absolute beating, but all it takes is one Sweet Chin Music, and Shawn can and has hit it from literally no where. It was always his great equalizer. It took down many a great men. I also don't see a guy as mentally tough as Shawn making a mistake.

I could run down the arguments that since anything goes, any of Shawn's running buddies could come in for the save, but that would cheapen the integrity of the 1v1 nature of the tournament.

So Shawn it is.

 

[NSL]

You know who has beaten Shawn, probably more than anyone? Triple H. And...who does Triple H model almost all of his offense after? Harley Race. If Triple H can beat Shawn using that offense, there's no reason to believe Race couldn't.

I'd imagine it's a case of "I taught you everything you know. Not everything I know."

 

[Hollywood Naitch]

You know who has beaten Shawn, probably more than anyone? Triple H. And...who does Triple H model almost all of his offense after? Harley Race. If Triple H can beat Shawn using that offense, there's no reason to believe Race couldn't.

I'd imagine it's a case of "I taught you everything you know. Not everything I know."

Great points. HHH based so much of his in-ring style on Harley Race, and if the imitator can beat Shawn, then the original could do- especially when that original is one of the toughest men in the history of the business.

If the gimmick match was something like a ladder match, I'd give HBK the advantage, but in this kind of brawl that can end up in a bar room, the car park, in a backstage room or deep in the crowd...it's more suited to Race's style, not Shawn's.

Don't just pick on modern-day name value, vote smartly. Vote Harley Race.

 

[nightmare]

Shawn has provided some great comeback moments & that damn kick can sure change the direction of a match quick. Resilient is the name of the game for HBK. Problem is that Shawn has not always come out on top despite his best efforts. This isnt a tag, ladder, rumble or traditional match where Shawn has shined before. It is a straight up fight against one of the toughest to ever lace a pair of boots. Race will make Shawn earn his check here & beats the shit out of him around the arena. I just dont see SCM taking Race out of this. Valiant effort by Shawn, but he comes up short here.

 

[enviousdominous]

Since this could be Harley's last round, pardon me while I go balls out here.

I think I'll start with a clip of a shoot interview with Harley Race:

[YOUTUBE]bbdbibVg7xY[/YOUTUBE]

Brody went for a kick, and Harley side-stepped him because it was in his better interest to do so. Harley said to Bruiser Brody "Frank, if you want this to go further just tell me." which prompted a monster like Brody to immediately tag out to Stan Hansen. Stan then potato sacked Harley when Harley was going for a suplex, which prompted Harley to push Stan into the corner and flip him out of the ring when his guard was down.

Case in point; nobody takes liberties with Harley Race.

Shawn was an amazing performer who proved that there could always be enough life left in him after a savage beating to seal a win, but at times he would flip the script and ham it up only because he was miffed at how he was being booked. Shawn's time in pro-wrestling is almost entirely made up of his work in the WWF/E, his work in AWA and Smokey Mountain is hardly note-worthy. He certainly has sway if he's in a match that's been put together by Kevin Dunn and Vince McMahon, but now we are way out of the cozy confines of a Titansports sanctioned match. Harley Race had influence anywhere he went and could easily wear any organization's world title.

Harley has plenty of reason to stomp some discipline into the forehead of Shawn Michaels, let's not forget Shawn's epic tantrum when fighting Vader who was one of Harley's early protégés. If Stan wants to beat you down and make an example of you, he's going do it.

Shawn eventually looks like a popped zit but finds that one little ounce of strength to crank out a split-second super kick, and Harley side-steps him before saying "This one's for Leon." which leads to a head-butt that prompts Shawn to just take this one.

Vote Harley Race.

 

[NSL]

If the gimmick match was something like a ladder match, I'd give HBK the advantage, but in this kind of brawl that can end up in a bar room, the car park, in a backstage room or deep in the crowd...it's more suited to Race's style, not Shawn's.

I don't know if I'd give him the ladder match win either. In this very arena, he had the most high profile ladder match in history...and lost. To Razor Ramon. Who would easily lose to Harley Race.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

Now I maybe in the minority here but SSlam 92 comes to mind and its the returning HBK. H pulls out everything just like Harley would but in a quick exchange pins Harley for the 1..2..3!

I swear to god Harley murders him post match but HBK just might sneak this.

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

Shawn Michaels has great history in Hardcore matches. He defeated Triple H, Vince McMahon and Chris Jericho in this type of match. But still I don't know who I'm going to vote here..

 

[Gallops77]

These matchups for me are the toughest. Harley has a great history and HBK is obviously a top performer of all time.

Michaels takes a brutal beating. Crimson mask and all. Somehow he connects with the Sweet Chin Music and steals one.

Vote HBK.

 

[NSL]

Shawn Michaels has great history in Hardcore matches. He defeated Triple H, Vince McMahon and Chris Jericho in this type of match. But still I don't know who I'm going to vote here..

We might as well just close the thread right now, and hand HBK the win! Do yourself a favor, and watch some NWA from the 1980's. It'll do you some good.

Race was a badass, and in the realm of kayfabe, took no shit from anyone. He fought "strong style" before it was a thing. I'm not saying he wipes the floor with HBK, but he wins nonetheless.

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

We might as well just close the thread right now, and hand HBK the win! Do yourself a favor, and watch some NWA from the 1980's. It'll do you some good.

Race was a badass, and in the realm of kayfabe, took no shit from anyone. He fought "strong style" before it was a thing. I'm not saying he wipes the floor with HBK, but he wins nonetheless.

I might not vote on this one, because in reality it wouldn't be fair to Harley Race, since I'm not familiar with his work.

 

[klunderbunker]

You know who has beaten Shawn, probably more than anyone? Triple H. And...who does Triple H model almost all of his offense after? Harley Race. If Triple H can beat Shawn using that offense, there's no reason to believe Race couldn't.

I'd imagine it's a case of "I taught you everything you know. Not everything I know."

And Shawn's biggest win over HHH is in......wait for it......wait for it......a street fight, which is pretty much what we've got here.

Now here's the thing: Race is indeed an insanely tough guy but it's not like he's invincible in these things. Hulk Hogan once beat him in a Texas Death Match. The thing is, Shawn is well known as a guy who is up against ridiculous odds and keeps coming back. He beat Diesel in a no holds barred match and HHH in a street fight after being out for four and a half years. Race is a VERY tough opponent but Shawn can kick him in the face for the pin, which he would here after a very brutal fight.

 

[Bernkastel]

Race is the type of wrestler that consistently won big fights. Shawn isn't. He is known as the guy that goes out there and gives the performance of the night. But that doesn't mean he should advance based sorely on that. Michaels is the type of work horse on par with Johnny Valentine and Ray Stevens. And like them he was tasked on drawing business in either smaller promotions or as an attraction. Shawn as a champion never translated into dollars. With Race it did. He was one of the last great touring NWA champions. And even though Race wasn't used well during his tenure in the WWE, history has been much kinder to him than some of his more unfortunate contemporaries. Thanks to the WWE promotional machine that continues to peddle Shawn Michaels and hype him up well outside his class as a pro wrestler.

All things considered I will throw myself behind Race here. Bigger star and better champion. And Shawn always makes a run in this thing, while Race has the pedigree to go much further than he usually does.

 

[ShinChan]

I voted Harley Race.

I know that Shawn is tough enough to suffer hard beatings from his opponents. If this match happens in reality, Race is gonna beat the hell out of Shawn.

Yupp Shawn will also get an upper hand during the match but the end would see Race going over Michaels here.

Race here.