I've seen, approximately, every WWE Bret Hart match ever. I've seen MOST CM Punk matches ranging from ROH, Mid-South, TNA and WWE. I've seen him compete in some barbaric matches against Raven, Joe, Styles, Aries, Umaga, and Jeff Hardy. And yes, experience does matter when speculating, if see Undertaker going up against Rey Mysterio in a Casket match, am I going with Rey? No. If I see Undertaker going up against Rey in a ladder match, I'd give the edge to Mysterio. Experience in match types matters plenty.
WCW Region, Third Round, Metal Object On A Pole Match: (3) Bret Hart vs. (11) CM Punk
- Thread starter klunderbunker
- Start date
CM Punk is by far the most overrated wrestler in the world today. Well maybe not by far, Daniel Bryan and Chris Jericho are also overrated as hell. This poll truly proves how overrated Punk is right now.
Bret Hart is better than Punk at EVERYTHING. I can't think of one single thing that Punk has over Bret. Bret is; a bigger draw, a more known worldwide name, a better storyteller, a better seller, a better technician, a better athlete, faster, a better brawler and a better champion. Bret is also more charismatic and better on the mic. I would take Bret's promos in 1997 over Punk's whole career. Punk doesn't even have the edge in aerial ability. Bret's elbow drop off the second rope, plancha and suicide dive are all more graceful than any of Punk's aerial moves. Bret is probably the kayfabe smartest and most tactical wrestler in history. I can't think of anyone that was as good as Bret at devising clear strategies and game plans to suit all of his opponents.
With the exception of Punk's match with Cena, I could probably name 40 matches in Bret's career that were better than ANYTHING Punk has ever done.
Bret was a main eventer for almost the entire decade of the 90's, holding world championships in 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997 and 1999. Bret lost clean less than 5 times during his whole singles run in WWE from 1991 to 1997. Even some of those clean losses had huge kayfabe question marks surrounding them, such as Bret having HBK locked in the Sharpshooter in the middle of the ring with nowhere to go, only for time to run out and HBK wins in overtime, and also Owen rolling Bret up for the upset when in kayfabe Bret didn't fully put his heart into the match because it was with his brother and he also had a world title match later in the night to think about. Bret Hart simply rarely lost matches, and almost never lost clean.
Bret Hart is ruthless when weapons are involved in a match. He tied Diesel's leg with a cable to the ring post and destroyed his leg with a chair, he became the first person to ever go through a table in WWE history, and ended up winning the match. Everyone knows what he did to Austin, the greatest brawler of all time, in their Submission match. He bloodied Austin, destroyed his leg with a chair, hit him with the ring bell, made him pass out to the Sharpshooter, and won the match. Bret has been busted open by Piper and Bulldog, and won both matches. He has had cage matches with Owen and Diesel, and won both matches. Notice a pattern here? Bret Hart wins matches, and he wins when weapons are involved.
Bret Hart has victories over; Perfect, Piper, Flair, HBK, Razor, Bigelow, Lawler, Yokozuna, Owen, Backlund, Diesel, Bulldog, Vader, Austin, Taker, Funk, Sting, Savage, DDP, Luger and Benoit. There is no way CM Punk can compare with that.
Don't vote for the skinny fat guy who looks like he smells of piss and hasn't showered in months. Vote for one of the greatest wrestlers of all time, Bret Hart.
Bret Hart is better than Punk at EVERYTHING. I can't think of one single thing that Punk has over Bret. Bret is; a bigger draw, a more known worldwide name, a better storyteller, a better seller, a better technician, a better athlete, faster, a better brawler and a better champion. Bret is also more charismatic and better on the mic. I would take Bret's promos in 1997 over Punk's whole career. Punk doesn't even have the edge in aerial ability. Bret's elbow drop off the second rope, plancha and suicide dive are all more graceful than any of Punk's aerial moves. Bret is probably the kayfabe smartest and most tactical wrestler in history. I can't think of anyone that was as good as Bret at devising clear strategies and game plans to suit all of his opponents.
With the exception of Punk's match with Cena, I could probably name 40 matches in Bret's career that were better than ANYTHING Punk has ever done.
Bret was a main eventer for almost the entire decade of the 90's, holding world championships in 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997 and 1999. Bret lost clean less than 5 times during his whole singles run in WWE from 1991 to 1997. Even some of those clean losses had huge kayfabe question marks surrounding them, such as Bret having HBK locked in the Sharpshooter in the middle of the ring with nowhere to go, only for time to run out and HBK wins in overtime, and also Owen rolling Bret up for the upset when in kayfabe Bret didn't fully put his heart into the match because it was with his brother and he also had a world title match later in the night to think about. Bret Hart simply rarely lost matches, and almost never lost clean.
Bret Hart is ruthless when weapons are involved in a match. He tied Diesel's leg with a cable to the ring post and destroyed his leg with a chair, he became the first person to ever go through a table in WWE history, and ended up winning the match. Everyone knows what he did to Austin, the greatest brawler of all time, in their Submission match. He bloodied Austin, destroyed his leg with a chair, hit him with the ring bell, made him pass out to the Sharpshooter, and won the match. Bret has been busted open by Piper and Bulldog, and won both matches. He has had cage matches with Owen and Diesel, and won both matches. Notice a pattern here? Bret Hart wins matches, and he wins when weapons are involved.
Bret Hart has victories over; Perfect, Piper, Flair, HBK, Razor, Bigelow, Lawler, Yokozuna, Owen, Backlund, Diesel, Bulldog, Vader, Austin, Taker, Funk, Sting, Savage, DDP, Luger and Benoit. There is no way CM Punk can compare with that.
Don't vote for the skinny fat guy who looks like he smells of piss and hasn't showered in months. Vote for one of the greatest wrestlers of all time, Bret Hart.
FitFinlay4Life
What's the craic?
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... and Jeff has much more experience in Ladder Matches than Rey. What was that about experience again?
Experience against who though? In Punk's case, nobody who matters. The match stip really is irrelevant, even if Punk gets the weapon first Hart is too smart to just walk into it.
Hulk Hogan's Brother
Stop asking me what I'm gonna do!!!
Punk has never really able to show his sick and twisted side in his matches. Bret Hart has, when he bloodied and beat Austin at WrestleMania 13 and continued to assault a bloodied man who had passed out with a chair.
That is the deal with Punk, you know. His bark is much worse than his bite but unfortunately that is not good enough to win him a match against the Excellence of Execution.
Holy shit - we're talking about hypothetical matches which don't even exist. Well, hypothetical matches don't exist by their very nature, but you get my point. We've (and by that, I mean "you've") finally gone off the deep end.
I appreciate your point, to a degree, but the example is a poor one. Rey Mysterio isn't particularly experienced in ladder matches. According to Online World of Wrestling anyway. He's had exactly one singles ladder match in his career; against Eddie Guerrero. His son was on the line and everything.
Now, enough about fucking Rey Mystero in a ladder match with The Undertaker. I'm not talking any more about hypothetical matches unless I absolutely have to.
Speaking of which, who would win in a match between Bret Hart and CM Punk? Better yet, what if it was an object on a pole match? Shit, I can top that - what if it was in WCW? That'd be pretty crazy. "What would happen if CM Punk and Bret Hart had a metal object on a pole match in WCW?" - one of life's great questions.
I've not read most of this thread, but I'm going to blindly assume that it consisted of both sets of fans calling the other fans' wrestler overrated. CM Punk is an internet darling and people only love him because he came through the indies and got politicked out of a title by The Undertaker, but Bret Hart is an overachieving midcarder who was fortunate to be in the spot he was in and got jostled out as soon as the actually worthy came in, etc. etc. Why let a wacky gimmick get in the way of such fun?
Me, I've never been a fan of rose-tinted goggles. I can, however, say that I've watched Bret Hart matches on DVD, and say that he was pretty good. Shit, he was pretty great. I changed the adjective after consideration - that's how passionate I am about this. As good as WWE marketing with their video packages and best of collections would have me believe? Well, how am I to know that?
At the end of the day, Hart was vulnerable. He had great matches, but he lost. Could he have conceivably lost to a CM Punk in his prime, one who's not lost to anyone clean? Sure. And I think it would be a watershed moment if he actually does that.
By the way, Punk would fucking clean up in a ladder match. Just saying.
I appreciate your point, to a degree, but the example is a poor one. Rey Mysterio isn't particularly experienced in ladder matches. According to Online World of Wrestling anyway. He's had exactly one singles ladder match in his career; against Eddie Guerrero. His son was on the line and everything.
Now, enough about fucking Rey Mystero in a ladder match with The Undertaker. I'm not talking any more about hypothetical matches unless I absolutely have to.
Speaking of which, who would win in a match between Bret Hart and CM Punk? Better yet, what if it was an object on a pole match? Shit, I can top that - what if it was in WCW? That'd be pretty crazy. "What would happen if CM Punk and Bret Hart had a metal object on a pole match in WCW?" - one of life's great questions.
I've not read most of this thread, but I'm going to blindly assume that it consisted of both sets of fans calling the other fans' wrestler overrated. CM Punk is an internet darling and people only love him because he came through the indies and got politicked out of a title by The Undertaker, but Bret Hart is an overachieving midcarder who was fortunate to be in the spot he was in and got jostled out as soon as the actually worthy came in, etc. etc. Why let a wacky gimmick get in the way of such fun?
Me, I've never been a fan of rose-tinted goggles. I can, however, say that I've watched Bret Hart matches on DVD, and say that he was pretty good. Shit, he was pretty great. I changed the adjective after consideration - that's how passionate I am about this. As good as WWE marketing with their video packages and best of collections would have me believe? Well, how am I to know that?
At the end of the day, Hart was vulnerable. He had great matches, but he lost. Could he have conceivably lost to a CM Punk in his prime, one who's not lost to anyone clean? Sure. And I think it would be a watershed moment if he actually does that.
By the way, Punk would fucking clean up in a ladder match. Just saying.
Hulk Hogan's Brother
Stop asking me what I'm gonna do!!!
Bret Hart's prime was what, about three and a half years long. CM Punk's prime has been about half a year long. This is like Cena vs Warrior all over again. You are booked to lose a few matches in your prime if you stay at the top of the tree for too long. Still, I cannot remember Bret losing too many matches clean. There was one loss against Shawn at WM 12 and possibly one against Owen at Mania 10 though I think Owen probably held on to the tights or something. Still, just two clean losses in over two years is mighty impressive, much more impressive than what Punk has been able to do if you consider the win/loss record.
And Punk did lose to HHH when both guys were interfered against. Meaning to say that he lost when both guys were at an equal footing.
Bret Hart is the more technically sound wrestler, he's actually wrestled in WCW, he's bloodied Steve Austin and forced him to pass out to the sharpshooter.
As much as I love Punk right now, he should go over one of the best technical wrestlers of all time.
Bret Hart to win via sharpshooter
As much as I love Punk right now, he should go over one of the best technical wrestlers of all time.
Bret Hart to win via sharpshooter
Oh yeah, sure, Austin had longetivity but Punk took the WWE Championship away from the WWE. He also got VKM fired from day-to-day operations in the WWE. So yes, it was a bigger deal.
His move-set is more than enough of a feature where he demonstrates plenty of speed. Hart's is slower.
Since his return, Jericho has pinned the World Heavyweight Champion. So yes, as I said, a force to be reckoned with.
I consider his prime to be from his second WWE Championship run onwards. Punk certainly wasn't in his prime when he was attached to the dead weight that was the New Nexus.
Vote Punk.
Hulk Hogan's Brother
Stop asking me what I'm gonna do!!!
Punk took the title away from WWE and lost it a month later. Austin got VKM arrested a number of times, held on to the title much longer than Punk despite no help at all ( Punk had help from Cena in getting reinstated) and even took VKM's job away.
Really, you are arguing as to which story is a bigger deal, Austin vs VKM or Summer of Punk? This is just the sort of argument that made me vote for Hart.
It isn't. Just because someone uses a few high flying moves does not mean that they are faster. Punk takes quite a while to set up his moves.
Also, who gives a rat's ass to which guy is faster. You would have to be stupid to assume that the metal object would not change hands. Bret would win because he has won hardcore matches against a better set of opponents than Punk. Also, because he is a bigger star.
Diesel in 1995, which is when Bret beat him, was a much bigger force then than Jericho is today.
He still lost to HHH after winning the title from Cena at MITB.
It sucks because CM Punk speaks IWC language he is beating Bret Hart here. It would still suck but I would prefer it if all the Punk supporters would just say they're voting for Punk because they like him better or because they don't remember Bret and just leave it at that. Instead people are either ignoring the facts or making stuff up.
Despite it being pointed out on numerous occasions people are just flat out ignoring Bret's ability as a brawler. If you didn't know about it or remember it that's fine. For it to be pointed out to you many times and for you to continue to ignore it is stupid. You think Punk is more aggresive than Hart? Ask Steve Austin. Ask Diesel. Ask Jerry Lawler. You think Bret is so much slower than Punk? Watch SummerSlam 91. Bret works whatever type of match is necessary against a given opponent to get the win. It's not like CM Punk is super fast anyway. Even if he is faster than Hart, which I'm not sure he is, it is not by much. Besides I don't think speed plays too much into this match anyway.
I like CM Punk but the bottom line is there is not one single thing in wrestling in which he is better than Bret. End the ridiculous arguments and just say you voted for Punk because his ice cream bar comment made you laugh and you thought it was funny when he wore Triple H's blazer. It would still be an injustice but at least it would be honest.
Despite it being pointed out on numerous occasions people are just flat out ignoring Bret's ability as a brawler. If you didn't know about it or remember it that's fine. For it to be pointed out to you many times and for you to continue to ignore it is stupid. You think Punk is more aggresive than Hart? Ask Steve Austin. Ask Diesel. Ask Jerry Lawler. You think Bret is so much slower than Punk? Watch SummerSlam 91. Bret works whatever type of match is necessary against a given opponent to get the win. It's not like CM Punk is super fast anyway. Even if he is faster than Hart, which I'm not sure he is, it is not by much. Besides I don't think speed plays too much into this match anyway.
I like CM Punk but the bottom line is there is not one single thing in wrestling in which he is better than Bret. End the ridiculous arguments and just say you voted for Punk because his ice cream bar comment made you laugh and you thought it was funny when he wore Triple H's blazer. It would still be an injustice but at least it would be honest.
It's...Baylariat!
Team Finnley Baylor
I'm just happy Hart's beaten here.
I get the love for Bret Hart. He's a simple wrestler with a simple move set and has had an illustrious career. Punk's more than likely at his peak at this moment in time... and in an environment where a pipe or whatever can be used, I can see Punk winning this.
But it's whatevs.
I get the love for Bret Hart. He's a simple wrestler with a simple move set and has had an illustrious career. Punk's more than likely at his peak at this moment in time... and in an environment where a pipe or whatever can be used, I can see Punk winning this.
But it's whatevs.
At least you know CM Punk will be good and drained going into the next round after getting sucked off so much here. While the marks were enjoying the Punk Juice, they also just showed how fucking ******ed they are, and why breeding should involve a screening process. CM Punk himself would probably go ahead and tell you he wouldn't beat Bret Hart in his prime, because even he knows he's not on that level, but don't let that stop you from getting on your knees for him folks. We wouldn't actually want the better man to win here no would we?
Steamboat Ricky
WZCW's Living Legend
How the hell did Punk win this thing? This entire thread should be transferred to the BULLSHIT thread. I love Punk...have his T-Shirts and shit...but he doesn't beat Bret yet...in no way do his accomplishments even compare. This is rather ridiculous.
The idea that C.M. Punk can not even possibly, conceivably, be seen anywhere near close to the same level of Punk is every bit as ridiculous. And the pity party/tantrum being thrown here shows that same crew are every bit as pathetic as the people they are calling out in this thread.
Hollywood Naitch
The current reigning and defending
I'm pretty sure everyone on here believes that Punk can be on the same level as Punk as, well..... he is Punk.
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