WWE Region, Dallas Region, First Round: (8) Curt Hennig vs (25) JBL

[Peoples_Champ]

No, not quite.

Hennig and Hogan did good business. JBL had people bored out of their minds. Bit of a difference there. JBL had no business being around the title. he got it because there was no one else there to give it to and Eddie wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire. I don't mind JBL, but to insinuate that he's some kind of a big deal because he got a world title in WWE is really wrong.

I absolutely agree with this. Somebody had a one-line entry on the first page stating how JBL had a world title and Hennig didn't therefore JBL would win. That's a ridiculous way to go about these tournament matches.

That being said, JBL in his prime with this limo-gimmick could have taken Perfect pretty easily. Any of JBL's other gimmicks ('Hawk' Bradshaw, APA, Acolytes, etc.) and I would give this to Perfect, but JBL was pretty hated in that role and he had a moveset that matched his demeanor. Perfect, on the other hand, had a nagging back injury that cannot be discounted.

 

[The Brain]

I'm actually a big fan of JBL and really enjoyed his title reign but I think I'm siding with Hennig here. JBL's title reign may have been better than Hennig's IC reigns but let's not forget about Hennig's year long AWA world title run. I would say that negates JBL's title reign in this match. If we say the title reigns cancel each other out the remainder of Hennig's career was more impressive than Bradshaw's.

 

[Bernkastel]

I'm actually a big fan of JBL and really enjoyed his title reign but I think I'm siding with Hennig here. JBL's title reign may have been better than Hennig's IC reigns but let's not forget about Hennig's year long AWA world title run. I would say that negates JBL's title reign in this match. If we say the title reigns cancel each other out the remainder of Hennig's career was more impressive than Bradshaw's.

I disagree; I don't think the two cancel each other out. For starters the WWE title had a much richer history at the time, and hardly any newer fans that were watching at the time would have remembered anything about the AWA.

Even if by some chance fans forget JBL's world title reign [which will be difficult considering the length of the title reign] the historical significance of jump starting John Cena's main event career when he won the belt off of JBL will never be forgotten.

I'd say JBL's WWE title reign trumps Hennig's AWA title reign because of that.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

Hey Chile Cole Miner, I really appreciate you not using personal preference as an argument.


That being said, if I had a billion amount of money, I would hire goons to break JBL's legs and make him a commentator. I like to hear him not see him. And definitely don't wanna see him work in the ring. If someone says "Oh gosh that means he was a good heel, thats why u hat him yo".

Well No. I would pay NOT to see JBL in 2004. I thought he was boring, pathetic matches. If anyone says GAB, I'll say Eddie's RBCs sold that match. However did JBL rule the roost for almost a year on SD? You bet your ass he did. But going through the card stacked with babyfaces and devoid of Hunter or a top heel, he was the best to boot. Not saying much. Brock had just left. Angle was working with who again? He did turn face in 04 right.

Anyway. I didn't like JBL in 04 and if that's the premise of his dominance. Vote Curt 'Mr. Perfect' Henning. Better wrestler, almost as accomplished on the mic. Never a champion, neither was Rowdy Piper.

 

[The Gribbler]

I think Hennig won a world title somewhere along the line, just not in the big two, although I may be wrong in that *jumps on wikipedia* Does the AWA world title count?

The reason I vote JBL in this match is because I didn't see Hennig in his prime. I saw JBL and hated him with a passion I had not hated a heel with in years. He did something that so many other heels had failed at. He made me hate him, or to put it another way, he did his damn job and he did it damn well..

So JBL is a very close match, Hennig dominates most but JBL pulls it out.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

JBL over Curt Henning because JBL won a world heavyweight championship while Henning never reached that accolade

Incorrect. Curt Hennig won the AWA World Heavyweight Championship in May of 1987 and held the title for about 370 days. He dropped the title to Jerry Lawler and, not long after, debuted in the WWF as "Mr. Perfect". Perfect was the last great champion that the AWA had.

As for this match, I'm with Hennig all the way. Hennig was the superior athlete, the superior technician and could toss in a few high flying moves here and there. I have no doubt JBL will get his shots in, the bigger & stronger brawler types always do. However, to me, JBL was usually more fun to listen to on the mic & on commentary than watching him wrestle. He was ok inside the ring and he'd give Hennig a pretty tough go for a while, but Hennig hits the Perfect Plex about the 10-12 minute mark for the win.

 

[cmiller1332]

I'm a Henning fan my only problem with this won is Henning didn't have much work with someone of JBL's size. I'm not basing this off of JBL winning the WWE title because I think that only happened cause Brock Lesner left and I didn't like JBL as a singles wrestler, I thought he was better in a tag team. I just don't see Henning being able to pull off a perfect-plex with JBL. Had Henning had someone like Jeff Hardy I would have went with him, but I'm going to have to go with JBL on this one as much as it sickens me.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

Hennig was involved in a feud for the WWF Championship. The guy holding that title was Hulk Hogan. Losing to Hogan is probably a bigger achievement than beating any of the guys Bradshaw did.

Obviously I'm a bigger Hennig fan, but I don't feel right voting for him. Then again, he was a victim of the time period in which he competed, so I can't vote against him, either. Bradshaw was a heavyweight champion with WWE, Hennig was not. However, that's not enough for me to vote against Hennig.

Just wanted to add a few things here. I'm not voting, by the way. Can't make up my mind.

 

[FunKay the Inevitable]

Curt Hennig's prime was in the WWF. He lost to Hulk Hogan and was, for about two months, the top heel in the company. He was a fantastic worked in the ring until his latter days where he just didn't work the same way he could. JBL's prime saw him enjoy the longest WWE Championship reign in a decade, defeat the likes of the Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero, Booker T, Kurt Angle and the Big Show. What's common about those names? They all were good to fantastic workers. Curt Hennig was the sort of guy who JBL would've been in a storyline with during the WWE Championship reign. He's exactly the sort of fodder he would've beaten too.

JBL was an opportunistic heel who won because he saw an opening to take and did so. Mr. Perfect was a tremendous in-ring performer who was better known for his ability to string together a match than to actually win. Yes he was AWA Champion for over a year, but really, when all is said and done, holding the WWE Championship nine months in the 00's is a bigger accomplishment than holding a world title for a year in the 80's.

 

[madness1992]

I want Mr. Perfect to win, But JBL has accomplished too much. JBL wins.

 

[Loveless]

The IC title of the early 90's was more prestigious and difficult to win than any world title on Smackdown over the last 10 years, that is why Perfect was better and why he would win this. As for the longevity argument, HTM was IC champion for a year. It only comes down to who was better in the ring and that's Perfect by a long way.

 

[Big Sexy]

Give me Mr Perfect all day. Yes Perfect never won the WWE title but there are two major reasons for that. First, Perfect's prime was in the Hulk Hogan era where not many people got a run with the belt. Second, in Perfect's prime there was only one world title where JBL had two to work with. If the WWE had two world title belts back in Perfect's era then I'd be willing to bet he would have been given a run.

JBL's title reign was also pretty awful even though it lasted a while. He was world champion on the WWE's B show and he was a right place, right time guy. He got the title after Lesnar left and before Cena became a mega star.

I'd also like to point out that almost all of JBL's victories during his peak were against faces and hardly any of them were clean. Mr Perfect would also be a heel in this match so the "cheating" aspect would be offset. Perfect was better in the ring, better on the mic, and he would win this match.

 

[The_Sharpshooter]

I'm definitely a bigger fan of Perfect. He's the kind of guy that made vignettes seem like PSAs. Him throwing boms to himself may have been the best thing creative ever thought of.

But he doesn't have the aggression or arsenal to keep JBL down. Layfield cannot match Curt's technical prowess, but Hennig DOES NOT want this match to get ugly. Plus, any wrestler performing from 1998-Present is kicking out the Perfect Plex. Ask Bobby Roode.

JBL with the win. Clothesline From Hell & he's putting his foot on the ropes for leverage.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

I gave my vote to Henning because he was in WWE All-Stars and JBL wasn't.

Seriously though I think a lot of people who are giving it to JBL based on his winning the WWE Title aren't taking into account the era that Henning was in at the top of him game. Hogan basically created a glass ceiling for other guys. It would be a good match but I really think Henning would take it

 

[The 1-2-3 Killam]

I'm glad to see this is a neck-and-neck race. Curt Hennig is one of the best men to lace up a pair of boots, but JBL was also a fierce WWE Champion and managed to hang on to his belt for quite a long time. Which is overly impressive in a time of mostly transitional champions meant to keep stagnant ratings afloat.

Curt Hennig was a fantastic technical wrestler - JBL has beaten fantastic technical wrestlers. His feud with Eddie Guerrero that launched the JBL character was excellent, winning him the WWE Championship. He also downed guys like the Undertaker, Big Show and Booker T during that championship reign. Here's the counter-point: most of those wins by either DQ or interference from Orlando Jordan and/or Heidenrich. A DQ doesn't advance him in this tournament, and if we open the floor up for interference the entire stability of the tournament is just shit.

JBL was able to beat guys like Finley and John Cena in hardcore-esk matches, but considering that this is a straight wrestling match, you would have to give the upper hand to Hennig. JBL, or Bradshaw, is no slouch though. I'm not sure it'd be an easy match for either to win, and honestly I voted for JBL before thinking it all the way through.

 

[Steamboat Ricky]

I'm voting JBL here simply because I'm pretty offended by his seeding. The guy was a very good heel, and it's a real shame to me that his character didn't take off higher than it did after his big title run.

I fully expect Perfect to go over here, but man, JBL as a heel is a classic character that I think was a victim of a bad time in wrestling. He really felt like a rich, arrogant, bastard.

 

[Saeros]

Um, no it wasn't. Actually, no, it isn't. The IC title was always the mid card title. JBL was WWE champion; first of all, you're already wrong in saying he was World Heavyweight Champion. He wasn't, he won the WWE title. Second of all, he won the main title of his brand, at the time when the brand extension actually meant two fucks. I get that you want to rationalize the fact Perfect never won a world title, but of all the ways, you've picked a horrendous one. You're wrong, end of story, good night.

Yes. The IC title has always been "considered" a midcard title. But in the late 80's and early 90's it was a massive deal. It was always defended on a PPV. The title was a huge deal. I may of gone over the top describing it as on the same level as the WH/WWE title (which yes i got wrong) But the IC title was still near a level of importance and prestige that the wwe title/world title was in 2004.

And Curt Hennig wasn't a career midcarder himself?

If you're using the argument Perfect would have been a main eventer in an era outside of the Hogan era, what's keeping me from saying Bradshaw was a victim of being in the Austin era? Even if Perfect never became champion because of Hogan, there was always a need for a heel to feud with Hogan. As I recall, Hogan and Perfect headlined house shows, and did bad business. Mind you, it was bad Hogan business, but it isn't as though Hennig was a burgeoning main event name; he was a mid card name. He sold extremely well for his opponents and made them look great, but JBL got somewhere Perfect just didn't

No he wasnt. Yes at the start of his WWE run, the end of his WCW run and his 2002 WWE run. But you can definatly put him in the upper reaches of Upper Midcard from 1989 - 1994 Which is different from just being a midcarder.

JBL did NOTHING until 2004. Absolutly nothing in 9 years. If Lesner hadn't left, JBL would never of been considered for the title. Smackdown needed a big heel that was healthy. Kurt Angle wasnt at the time.

When you compare the two in all forms of wrestling ability. That includes the little things that make wrestling matches like psychology, selling, safety, charisma etc. Perfect comes out on top. In terms of promo work, Perfect comes out on top. JBL was fantastic at what he did. But in my eyes, he comes nowhere near what Hennig done or accomplished.

 

[The Best]

I'm voting JBL here. Even though Hennig does have the argument that he was around when Hogan had the belt, JBL did face some good guys while having the belt. Guys like Booker T, The Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero, and Big Show. He won the US title from Chris Benoit, and defended it very well as well. JBL was great and I think very under rated as the WWE champion.

Vote JBL.

 

[ShreddedWheat]

I believe that if you swapped these guys' heyday eras, Mr. Perfect would have risen higher in the Attitude/Ruthless Aggression era than JBL would have back in the late 80s/early 90s. Mr. Perfect wins.

 

[Tastycles]

JBL's career can be summed up pretty effectively by looking at three consecutive Royal Rumble PPVs. In 2004, he was the first man eliminated, having lasted a grand total of 38 seconds in the ring. In 2006, he lost to the Boogieman in less than two minutes. In 2005, he won a World Championship defence. Ridiculous. One year wonder doesn't even begin to cover it.

Mr. Perfect didn't lose a wrestling match for about 2 years, and was the biggest heel in the company, something JBL, even as world champion couldn't claim to be thanks to Mr. Paul Levesque. Perfect was more popular than Bradshaw ever was, and he deserved to have been given a run with a world title. Whenever there's a "should have been world champion" thread, they pretty much always come up with Hennig.

JBL was a World Champion, but he won it in 2004. A brief education for you... When Brock Lesnar, The Rock and Goldberg left the WWE, they were left with a huge void to be world champion. This was made worse when Angle got injured during that year. Edge, a probable promotion candidate was severely injured, and Cena and Batista weren't ready to take the reigns. So, the WWE put the title on a load of people to see if they could make it work. The new champions at that time included Benoit, Guerrero, JBL and a 24 year old Orton.

Orton didn't get another shot for three years after his go, and the others where never anywhere near the Championship again. In short, they were temporary measures until Batista and Cena were ready. That doesn't make them good in the all time scheme of things.

Perfect gave more to wrestling than JBL ever did, and should win.

 

[The Brain]

I disagree; I don't think the two cancel each other out. For starters the WWE title had a much richer history at the time, and hardly any newer fans that were watching at the time would have remembered anything about the AWA.

I'm not sure that the WWE title had a much richer history. The AWA title was established in 1960 and the WWE title was established in 1963. The AWA title has been defunct since 1990 but I think for the first twenty years or so the AWA title was considered second behind the NWA title.

Since this is an all time tournament I don't think it matters that newer fans don't know anything about the AWA. Just because new fans don't know about it doesn't mean we should ignore it. One of the great things about this tournament is that it gives us the opportunity to learn about wrestling's past.

Even if by some chance fans forget JBL's world title reign [which will be difficult considering the length of the title reign] the historical significance of jump starting John Cena's main event career when he won the belt off of JBL will never be forgotten.

I'd say JBL's WWE title reign trumps Hennig's AWA title reign because of that.

I'd like to point out the Iron Sheik isn't even in this tournament. I don't see how losing to Cena is relevant in a match against Hennig. If you take away JBL's title reign his career was rather unimpressive. If you take away Hennig's title reign he still had a good career.

 

[Silly Willy Nilly Vanilly in the Milly]

Hennig was Mr. Perfect.
JBL was one of, if not, THE greatest heel of his time.
Hennig was better technically.
JBL had more power.
Worst comes to worst...
JBL had a world title, Hennig didn't.
Plus, JBL offered me a few thousand bucks to vote for him anyway.
Vote Layfield.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

Man, I hate posting after Tastycles because he has already summed things up so well.

But I would say this. Hennig was an IC champ at a time when the IC champion was a number one contender for the world championship. Ultimate Warrior was the IC champion when he took on Hogan at Mania 6 and so was Shawn Michaels when he took on Bret Hart at Survivor Series 1992. During Hennig's time, the IC champion was basically either the 2nd or the 3rd most important guy in the company, something which JBL was not able to achieve despite being a champion. Yeah, don't tell me he was more important to the company in 2004 than HHH, HBK, Orton of even Benoit. Smackdown was the B-show in 2004 and that too by a long shot.

Hennig's prime not only coincided with that of Hulk Hogan but also with that of a very charismatic Ultimate Warrior. But for the meteoric rise of Warrior, Hennig would have surely been the guy to main event Mania 6. Hennig also wrestled at a time when heels did not win much and as a face he has some impressive victories against even the likes of Ric Flair. Hennig's injury also made the company circumspect about putting the title on him. He could have really shot to superstardom after Hogan left but for his injury.

JBL became champ in 2004 when no one was around and for most part of his career, he was a lower midcarder. I find Pippa's claim ludricuous when he says that JBL was overshadowed by the presence of Austin. Dude, even Matt Hardy was a bigger star than JBL before 2004. So were Albert and X-Pac. JBL was never even one of the top 25 performers of the company before 2004 while Perfect was always safely one of the top 10 to 15 performers of the company.

Also, it is not that Hennig has not won a World Championship. He won the AWA World Championship from a legend like Nick Bockwinkel and held it for 53 weeks. That is a reign as impressive as that of JBL on Smackdown in 2004.

Vote Hennig. Easy choice really.

 

[nightmare]

This is a match Perfect would win. He would get dominated by JBL at first, then Perfect would find an opening and run with it. Bradshaw has some great tools at his disposal, but people give him more credit than is really there. His great work on the mic covered up what he didnt have in the ring. JBL will be remembered for his great promo work rather than any big matches he had. He is a great brawler and one of the best heels this decade. Problem is that he is going up against one of the best in history. A man that was arguably the best ever not to hold a major WWF title. Perfect was arrogant and was so technically badass, he could back it up in the ring. All the young kids in the crowd should just go back and watch some of his stuff. Fantastic.


Both are great heel wrestlers but the problem is that JBL would ultimately get frustrated. JBL would make a mistake and its over from there. This dosent fit Bradshaw because he cant really cheat to win and sneak a victory. If it were no DQ or something then JBL would be able to gain the slight advantage and just brawl. Unfortunatley he is going against one of the smarter wrestlers in Perfect. This is a match that Perfect would love. He has great conditioning and when JBL gets frustrated, Perfect goes in for the kill. He takes him apart, keeps him off his feet and after a mistake by JBL- Perfect hits a roll up around the 15 minute mark.

 

[Hulkamaniac]

Mr. Perfect would be Bradshaw. He's a better worker, a better drawing card, and a better promo (although JBL got very good late in his career.) Mr. Perfect really was Perfect. The only thing that stopped him from becoming a World Champion and a contender for GOAT status was unfortunate and debilitating back injuries.

Vote smart. Vote well. Vote Perfect.